September 8th hot fest

[Loren]

Joe, I think you're onto something.

[JasonS]

I took Daniel for an run to get some pointers as I was far off the pace. That was the first thing he pointed out that I did wrong. As I continued to focus on that I took a second off my time. Think that time was split between that exact spot and not overdriving (as much) the offsets after the turnaround.

[twistedwankel]

I don't take personal videos anymore because they bore the shit out of me and I forget to turn shit on - watching me drone. Like watching a 7 year old rerun on tv.

Actually we watch 2 month old reruns on tv as we don't remember anything from then. Damn. Guess some people need to learn from their mistakes. I cannot. Damn.

[SlowMiataDrew]

Well my camera thought it would be great to die just after I started my best run so here's my second best run, off by .1 and a cone. Car felt really good! I can't wait to get some more runs in it. Any comments or criticism welcome

https://youtu.be/RyD_kKdoLlg

[CaptainSquirts]

So what's the consensus about pogoing, is it a negative thing? As you can see in Andrews video that sucker is bouncing everywhere. I've only had it when my shocks were set at a pretty stiff setting and happened only at the turn around when throttling out. Softening up the shock reduced/got rid of it.

[Loren]

Pogoing = loading and unloading tires = not good. The suspension's job is to keep the tires in contact with the pavement, preferably with a fairly consistent or at least predictable level of load/grip.

You want just enough damping to control the movement of the shock ("critical damping"), maybe a tiny bit more. In stock class, where suspension modifications are limited to mostly shocks, it's not uncommon to over-adjust shocks as a band-aid solution to handling problems (such as understeer on a FWD car). And that can work. But, in a class that allows spring rate changes, you should be doing GROSS adjustment with springs, secondary adjustment with swaybars, and fine-tuning with shocks and tire pressure. The shocks should ONLY be doing their job... controlling the motion of the springs.

[CaptainSquirts]

So what would be the best way to tell if the shock is critical damped?

I'm not well versed at this stuff so correct me if I'm wrong.
1. under damped would be basically phillips shocks. They just bounce all day if you hit a pot hole and eventually return back to normal.
2. Critical damped - Shock hits a pot hole but does one bounce or so and is back to its original position.
3. Over damped - ???? Would over damped be considered the pogo?

Is the main goal to be critical damped, trying to get the shock do not bounce a lot and get to its original position quickly? If so do we just start the adjustable shock at softest and increase up to the point where it gets pogo'y and then back off a couple of clicks?

[jbrannon7]

So what would be the best way to tell if the shock is critical damped?

I'm not well versed at this stuff so correct me if I'm wrong.
1. under damped would be basically phillips shocks. They just bounce all day if you hit a pot hole and eventually return back to normal.
2. Critical damped - Shock hits a pot hole but does one bounce or so and is back to its original position.
3. Over damped - ???? Would over damped be considered the pogo?

Is the main goal to be critical damped, trying to get the shock do not bounce a lot and get to its original position quickly? If so do we just start the adjustable shock at softest and increase up to the point where it gets pogo'y and then back off a couple of clicks?

http://www.koni-na.com/en-US/NorthAmeri ... der-Steer/

[Bigdog]

liked the course, liked the song, like the cheering, liked the new sway bars, liked the last runs on the OEM "performance" Pzero rubber, did not like my times, but had loads of fun!!!


https://youtu.be/45_XkLswdtE?t=3


need to push harder, did not toast one cone on any runs. perhaps that means I am an awesome driver - NOT

[Native]

These vids are great! Thanks to all for posting.

[Loren]

need to push harder, did not toast one cone on any runs. perhaps that means I am an awesome driver - NOT

Turn off the music and listen to the tires!

Looks like you've mastered the first hurdle of learning to autocross: You're not getting lost, and you're not hitting cones. Which means you're inherenty probably looking ahead reasonably well.



Course Options: Consider them carefully. The option that gives you the best EXIT is almost always the best way to go. On the outgoing side of this course, you had an option box, and an optional slalom. The exit of the slalom was the key. You wanted to exit on the left to get a little straight, and a better setup for the cross-course sweeper. To exit on the left, you had to enter on the right. To easily enter on the right with any amount of speed, you had to take the option box to the LEFT. While you're learning, pay attention to what the fast guys are doing!

Otherwise, you were driving okay. Typical "muscle car guy" throttle inputs. Driving slaloms and turns too slowly, and then jabbing the gas anytime something looks straight. Get on the gas earlier and more progressively. Try to make more out of the turny bits! Torque is great fun, but it's not going to make up for time lost while turning. Learn to drive as if you were in a "momentum car". It's not how fast you go, it's how little you slow down! Add quick acceleration to that skillset... then you've got something!

Look ahead even more than you already are. For example, the last slalom cone before the finish. You should see that 2 cones before you get to it and know "hey, there's a straight after this", and be on the gas between the last two slalom cones, if not earlier. You coasted through the slalom (no tire noise), then mashed the gas AFTER passing that last slalom cone. We're talking an easy .5-.75 seconds right there in that slalom.

Of course, you're obviously having a ton of fun... so, there's that!

[Bigdog]

Loren

thanks for the advice; always appreciated and much needed.

on the outgoing option box: knew to enter the slalom on the right to exit on the left (actually the course sweeper was my favorite part). My original plan was left on the box option cone, but changed after working station 2 on the second run. this run was full of the corvette Krewe. It looked like half of them hit the box with too much speed and toasted the cone getting to the left. thought to carry more speed going into the box by going right. burn it off and pour it on coming out into the rt on the slalom. main regret was not trying a left on the option cone.

the real question is why would I let a Chevy influence my line

[Loren]

Oh, leave the Ford v Chevy at the drag strip. It's all driver here.

What are the fast DRIVERS doing?

Joe has already addressed what people were doing wrong to hit that center cone when going left. (And he wasn't even at this event!)

[twistedwankel]

the real question is why would I let a Chevy influence my line

Same reason we all watch a lame ass Mirage kick our butts.

[CaptainSquirts]

I too go the opposite line that the subarus take. I would never let a Subaru influence my line. Mitsubishi AWD > Subaru AWD .



P.s jk, AWD peeps need to stick together to take down the lightweight rear wheel drive kings .

[twistedwankel]

If all you big power guys spent 1/2 the time behind the wheel of your cars as you do underneath messing with them you'd be pretty darn unbeatable

It is easier for a fast driver to hit a cone and lose than to learn finesse and win.

[Bigdog]

better check out my little pony!

only a turbo I4 with less P2W than the shoeboxes

ending up with class1; at least there appears to be less competition

[Loren]

You don't know what "less P2W" is, my friend. You really don't. I'll let you take a run in the Mirage sometime if you want to know.

On another topic, we (all of us) need to discuss something. (not saying you're doing anything wrong, Mike, you just instigated a thought)

There seems to be a lot of "optional car placement" going on, or at least being talked about. There are a handful of instances where that's perfectly okay. But, there are other instances where it's NOT. Your car should only be competing in a class that it is eligible for. You can't just "bump up" randomly outside of what the rules allow.

For instance. S4 cars (that are in HS) can "bump down" to S5. Likewise, they can "bump back up" to S4. They have that option. HS cars can run in either S4 or S5, with S5 having some restrictions. THAT IS THE ONLY "bumping" that should ever happen in Stock! You can't bump from S4 to S3, or from S1 to S0. That's not how it works. In most cases, there is not a "linear" progression between the stock classes. S3, for instance is just DIFFERENT from S4. Different kinds of cars. Not necessarily faster on an autocross course. Very course dependent.

In Modified, there's a similar "bump down" situation from M3 to M4.

And in Modified, if your power mods exceed the limits of the class, you get bumped up ONE CLASS from your base class. So, if you started in M3, you'd bump to M2. That doesn't mean you get to decide "I'm going to run in M1 because there's less competition" (or better competition). An overpowered M3 car goes to M2. Period. There are no "double class bumps".

The exception being M0. It's the unlimited class (as long as safety rules are met). And if you want to tell us you belong in the unlimited class, we're going to take your word for it.

I've just been seeing and hearing about way too much "Oh, I'll just bump myself up in this class" talk lately.

[Bigdog]

Since I do not consider myself competitive in any class and just enjoy the fun, my vehicle classing is strictly based on the FAST guidelines. Certainly, I could have interpreted the rules incorrectly.

The SCCA guidelines shows an ecoboost mustang as a DS which is a class S2. the stock rules do not allow modified ECU or boost increase, I have a COBB tune. now an M2. the modified rules requires a bump up one class for a non-factory intercooler and a tune, looks like M1.

can have fun in any class, my only competition is myself.

[CaptainSquirts]

Since I do not consider myself competitive in any class and just enjoy the fun, my vehicle classing is strictly based on the FAST guidelines.

I wasn't close to competitive when I started or even after a good year and a half. But always willing to ask for advice, have people ride along, have people ride your car(they will drive it quicker, cough cough steve...) and etc, you can become competitive if you're willing to learn. Once I actually got pretty decent and my time gap grew more thin, the more fun it got. I remember the first time I had the fastest clean raw time. I got jittery, nervous, excited, scared, pretty much like every emotion crammed in together all at the same time. Ended up losing it in the last run to like 5 people passing me but holy crap, being near the top for the first time felt out of this world. You can always learn and have fun at the same time, but if you dont care at all about being competitive then thats okay as well. Autocross is probably one of the most safest ways to have fun without running into a wall so do what makes you have fun and happy .

I still remember the days, coming in 60th place in raw times out of 90. . Regardless, it was still fun!
http://drivefast.org/wp/Results/2016/20 ... ByTime.pdf