Sorting out the Miata

[Evil MS3]

Ok, so now that I've got the legal and on the road I need to start thinking about all of the other bits of it that make a Miata, a Miata. I'm talking tires, suspension, alignment, etc. I haven't had a chance yet to really examine the current suspension so that's obviously step one. But this is where I need some help from the experts here who have a wealth of Miata knowledge. This car is going to be driven 90% for autox purposes, so anything I do will have that in mind.

Tires:
- Check: A minty fresh set of 205/50/15 RE71s on the way.

Brakes:
- Check: Relatively new (<6 months) rotors, Hawk HPS pads and SS lines.

Alignment:
- What specs? I've been reading different setups here and there and I know the FM site has some recommendations, but what's the consensus here on what specs are best?
- Where's the recommended place to go for a custom alignment?

Suspension:
- I'm under the assumption that most of the components of my 122k mile car are probably original so I definitely need to look it over and check the bushings and bump stops (I found the link for the Amazon bump stops Loren recommends).
- Now I guess the question I need to answer for myself is do I want to stay in S4 and just do new shocks, or make a move to M3 and do coilovers. That's a TBD for me.
- Rear sway: I'm gonna plan on doing a run on my first event with the rear sway connected, then disconnected to see the differences and what best fits my driving style.

What else am I missing? What should I be inspecting or looking out for?

[CaptainSquirts]

Suspension:
- I'm under the assumption that most of the components of my 122k mile car are probably original so I definitely need to look it over and check the bushings and bump stops (I found the link for the Amazon bump stops Loren recommends).
- Now I guess the question I need to answer for myself is do I want to stay in S4 and just do new shocks, or make a move to M3 and do coilovers. That's a TBD for me.

Do you plan on having the car modded in the short future? If so I would honestly go the coilover route and probably at least poly bushings. I'm all about doing it once and doing it right.

Other than that, if you haven't gone over all the fluids like brakes, transmission and etc. Maybe a good time to do those as well.

[Evil MS3]

Do you plan on having the car modded in the short future? If so I would honestly go the coilover route and probably at least poly bushings. I'm all about doing it once and doing it right.

Other than that, if you haven't gone over all the fluids like brakes, transmission and etc. Maybe a good time to do those as well.

Yeah, that's my hangup as well when it comes to the suspension, stay stock or go full suspension. It's a decision I'll have to make soon as I don't like doing things twice either.

I forgot to mention fluids, that's on my list. Engine, trans and diff fluids are all getting replaced since I have no idea when they were last done.

[Loren]

I always like to see how far I can get in stock class before going mod.

Bushings should be fine. All you need is shocks and maybe a front bar.

Stock is limited to 2 degrees of camber, so go to 2 in the rear and whatever you can get in the front.

Caster affects "feel". If you like really tight steering and you have PS, run all of it. (You'll give up maybe a tenth of a degree camber for every degree of caster) Manual steering or a light touch, maybe keep it under 4.5

Zero toe. Maybe a tiny bit of rear toe in for stability. Maybe a tiny bit of front toe out for sharper turn in.

Go win stuff!

[Jamie]

Since everyone who drives it seems to like my setup (including Philip):

Front: as much camber as you can get (neg 1-1.5 deg, depending), and accept whatever caster that gives you (about 4 deg). Zero toe. I have PS, and the steering feel is just fine.
Rear: neg 1.5-2 deg, and a breath of toe in (about 1/32" per side).

That's on an otherwise stock Hard S suspension. I've kept the rear bar on.

[Loren]

I have PS, and the steering feel is just fine.

I think there's a very wide range of "fine", especially with power steering. Anywhere between about 4.5 and 7 degrees is going to feel "fine". It's only when you get to the very extremes that things will feel notably different. You REALLY feel it with a manual rack.

If you have PS, you'd feel the difference in back-to-back testing between like 5 and 7 degrees, but it wouldn't be anything dramatic. As Jamie said, it will feel "just fine".

[Evil MS3]

Thanks for the pointers. Any suggestions on who ya'll like to use for alignments?

[CaptainSquirts]

Joe B

[Jamie]

Thanks for the pointers. Any suggestions on who ya'll like to use for alignments?

Joe is painstaking, and keeps at it until it's right, but be prepared to spend some time on it -- with his setup, there's lots of time spent moving the car up and down and up and down. I've also had good results from Advanced Performance Tire and Wheel in Carolwood. Don't know the ground that far down in Pinellas, so can't recommend anything close to you.

[jaball77]

You're going to be in S4? Uhhh... you want LOTS of toe out in the rear and POSITIVE camber in the front!

But seriously...

I had my guy max out the front camber, then match the rear to that. I think it's about -1.0 degrees at both ends with 0 toe.

Everyone else has given good advice. Only additional thing I would mention are bump stops. At 122k yours are probably crumbling if not completely gone by this point. When you order shocks, get some bump stops as well since you're going to have it apart anyway and they're cheap.

Koni Sports are the easy button for shocks and they're ok but not perfect. There's always Bilstein B8 if you want to get a "better" shock and save some money.

[Loren]

NB front bump stops aren't bad, but the rears are made of a different material, and it literally crumbles and turns to dust after about 5 years. If you haven't replaced your rear bump stops, you probably don't have any. Really fun if you're into snap oversteer.

[Jamie]

NB front bump stops aren't bad, but the rears are made of a different material, and it literally crumbles and turns to dust after about 5 years.

No lie!
https://www.facebook.com/274737019614/p ... 15/?type=3

[Evil MS3]

Ok, so since I'm still not familiar with everyone in FAST, who is Joe B?

[Magooiii]

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2566

Ok, so since I'm still not familiar with everyone in FAST, who is Joe B?

[Evil MS3]

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2566

Ok, so since I'm still not familiar with everyone in FAST, who is Joe B?

You da man. That's who I figured it was haha

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[Evil MS3]

Looks like y'all wore out poor JoeB. He's taking the rest of the summer off cuz it's too hot for that kinda work for him. Totally understand.

Any other recommendations?

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[Loren]

Obviously, you're not afraid of turning wrenches and doing homework. If you're interested in learning DIY alignment, I can help.

It's not difficult to do, and you can take it to whatever level of detail you want. Joe basically does a DIY alignment, he just takes it more seriously than I do. He's fabricated some equipment to level the car, uses a proper digital camber gauge, etc.

What I've learned over the years is that the difference between a perfect alignment and one that's "close enough" is nearly imperceptible from the driver's seat. We're not perfect drivers, and we don't drive on perfect surfaces. "Close enough" will get you there. I've been doing my own alignments for about 10 years now using nothing more than a measuring tape and a 2-foot level. That gets my camber within a tenth or so, and toe within maybe 1/32" per side.

I've got time on some weekdays if you want. Plan on a couple hours. Or, if you're trying to get it done soon... maybe this weekend. After that, I've got 3 back-to-back autocross weekends, so time will be scarce.

[Evil MS3]

Obviously, you're not afraid of turning wrenches and doing homework. If you're interested in learning DIY alignment, I can help.

It's not difficult to do, and you can take it to whatever level of detail you want. Joe basically does a DIY alignment, he just takes it more seriously than I do. He's fabricated some equipment to level the car, uses a proper digital camber gauge, etc.

What I've learned over the years is that the difference between a perfect alignment and one that's "close enough" is nearly imperceptible from the driver's seat. We're not perfect drivers, and we don't drive on perfect surfaces. "Close enough" will get you there. I've been doing my own alignments for about 10 years now using nothing more than a measuring tape and a 2-foot level. That gets my camber within a tenth or so, and toe within maybe 1/32" per side.

I've got time on some weekdays if you want. Plan on a couple hours. Or, if you're trying to get it done soon... maybe this weekend. After that, I've got 3 back-to-back autocross weekends, so time will be scarce.

I certainly appreciate that offer and I think I'll probably take you up on it since I'd love to be able to learn how to align my cars myself. I've still got to get the tires on and check my bump stops. Would hate to go through all that just to pull the suspension apart and have to do it again

[Loren]

Tires won't change alignment. And on a Miata, changing shocks doesn't affect alignment UNLESS it changes ride height. (Roughly one degree per inch) Any change in ride height changes camber. And any change in camber affects front toe. (Rear toe is stable)

[CaptainSquirts]

Seems like a good time to get some toe plates and a camber gauge if you plan on altering the suspension throughout the year. Almost anything you do will alter the alignment. Definitely worth the initial cost and learning experience, will save a ton down the road!