FASTiva Blown Head Gasket -- Wat Do?

[Native]

Done blowed up the head gasket on our new engine. [ <---- said the moderator not me for sake of thread clarity ]

So maybe this is a stretch, but, many of the bolts and nuts (and spark plugs) on that engine were very loose. Is it possible the head bolts only need to be properly torqued to seal up the head gasket?

[Loren]

I think it's very possible that the head wasn't properly torqued and that's what caused the head gasket to fail. Especially since the engine never even got close to overheating.

I don't think retorquing a head gasket that's already been leaking is feasible. Might work, might not. I've already used one AAA tow for the year, I'd like to not have to do it again. Head gasket is easy enough to replace.

But, we have options to consider:

1. Replace the head gasket, and hope for the best. This is the cheapest/quickest/easiest option (short of just retorquing the head). The peril here lies in all that you said about "everything" on this engine not seeming properly torqued. Is the bottom end about to fall apart, too? Would probably cost under $50 all told.

2. Install the original engine, the one with the fresh crankshaft and new bearings... already new head gasket and valve stem seals, and generally thought to be a good engine. Only problem with that one is the "mystery chunk of metal" that we pulled out of it when we took it apart. No idea what it is or where it came from. This wouldn't really cost us anything but time. That engine is pretty much ready to drop in.

3. Install the original engine, but go ahead and have the head reworked. A healthy shave would net us .5 points of compression (from 9.2 to 9.7). Not a huge improvement in power, but little. Could look at a little port work to match the manifold gaskets, as well. This would take a little more time and cost a little more money, but there WOULD be a performance benefit... which would make the rework a little easier to swallow, at least for me. Repairs that include upgrades are always better than just straight repairs! I'm not sure what the head work would cost here. Maybe $50 for a shave... another $100 for light porting? $20 head gasket, etc. Maybe $2-300 by the time we're done?

Other options we could consider that I'm not really keen on:

4. Find a "good" used 1.6 and drop it in there. It's a direct bolt-in swap. Blows our classing up to M2. Makes our transmissions "glass". Would probably cost $2-300+ if we find a cheap engine. Of course it comes with the big bag of mystery... is it really a good engine? On the pro side, if the FASTiva with 63 hp is stupid fun to drive and makes EVERYONE smile when they drive it... 110 hp is going to be RIDICULOUS! And it's possible that it just might even be reasonably competitive in M2... as long as we can keep a transmission under it.

5. Build a 1.6 from the parts in my garage. I have a block and a head. Should have a set of pistons and rods. Would need to source a crankshaft. Full rebuild and gasket kit. Would be cheap for a rebuild (maybe $500-800?), but would be a lot cheaper and easier to find a complete FWD- configured 1.6 engine.

The only significant "pro" to doing the 1.6 swap (aside from it being fun) is that it might make it easier for us to sell the project when we're ready.

[twistedwankel]

Ben read this and is looking for a Fit with a shaky history.

You guys are awesome. Love what you do with nothing. It's like shit/shape shifting.

[Native]

^^^ that Festiva is just a chunk o' putty...

as for the rebuild:
IMHO, I guess it depends on your goal. If you're only looking to make the car dead-on reliable again, you gotta go with "knowns," as opposed to "unknowns." The current engine, clutch, and tranny are unknowns, regardless of what the seller said and certainly in light of the breakdown. "Knowns" are the engine that was just pulled, and/or the one you have partially rebuilt that you could finish rebuilding. Or, keep rebuilding the one in the car now each time it breaks. Given all the work you've just recently put into it, and thus are tired, I'd say, for now, choose the simplest, cheapest fix. Not sure if that's #1 or #2 above...

[Loren]

Gagel's over in Riverview has a 1.6 Capri engine with about 105k miles for... $99. I wonder if it's damaged?

There are a bunch of them for $150-200.

This is all just crazy talk. Right?

[Native]

Sure is. You already have 3 1.3's, and could build your own 1.6.

[Loren]

If we do a 1.6, having one out of a FWD car would make it a lot easier. Gives us all the correct intake/exhaust manifolds, coolant routing, engine mount brackets, sensors, etc, etc. The 1.6 Miata engine has Miata manifolds that won't work with FWD, and the Festiva manifolds won't fit the 16v 1.6 head.

But, yeah, we do have three 1.3 engines in the garage. (that could arguably be sold for $100+ each)

[AScoda]

6. pull head, put head from motor #1 on it. check #2 head for warpage, re-build it and put back on engine #1
Most importantly, keep that silly valve cover.

Also, what else was that transmission used in? I bet it was used in other cars with possibly more power. It's a good jump from stock power, but it's still only 110HP. I can't see a manufacturer building such a spindly weak transmission that it can't handle more than 60 horses.

[Loren]

Drew, the basic transmission design has several variants, and was used as late as a few years ago in things like the Ford Escape. But, THIS version, the one that fits in this car without modification and with the axles that we have (that are new), is known to spit diff gears out the side of its case with a 1.6 swap.

Even with stock power... that's why we swapped it. Diff gears were starting to whine and lots of wear.

We can upgrade to a different trans, but it requires modification of the engine cradle, conversion to a hydraulic clutch, and new axles.

Slippery slope.

[Rawkkrawler]

I've been wanting to upgrade my welder, this sounds like the perfect excuse to do so. Let's cut that thing up! Can we make it all wheel drive while we're at it?

[Loren]

Mike, we'll make you a fantastic deal on the parts car shell. Knock yourself out!

[Rawkkrawler]

I'll first need to find a loophole in my HOA docs. I've already had to ask for the definition of "too loud". Oh, and i'm on the board..

[ImpostorDan]

Maybe you could submit the fast rules as a sample article.

[Loren]

Anyhow... Ben and I have decided on Option #2. Reinstall the original engine. Fresh bearings, fresh head gasket, fresh valve stem seals. It's a little more work to get it in there, but it is our best and most affordable option.

[nathanwilliams617]

I'd go with #5. "Build a 1.6..." This way you know exactly what's what with the engine. Reduces the probability for suprises that can come with used engines.

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[nathanwilliams617]

Oh you made a decision already... lol

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[Loren]

Yeah, all the talk about a 1.6 is just pie-in-the-sky at this point. We don't want to invest that much into it.

[lddavis91]

FWD V8 LS4.jpg (165.56 KiB) Viewed 10493 times

[Loren]

Spent a few minutes looking under the exhaust manifold with a flashlight and a mirror this morning.

The freeze plugs are all liberally coated with grime and show no signs of being steam-cleaned or otherwise leaking. It looks pretty clear that it's the head gasket leaking somewhere around cylinder 2 and 3.

If it was a freeze plug or something else, we might have considered repairing it. But, it seems to be the head gasket. With a fresh engine on the stand, repairing this one just doesn't make sense.

[Loren]

Taking inventory by photograph.

This is the original engine. Crankshaft has been turned, new bearings. Headgasket and valve stem seals previously replaced. Crankshaft and Cam oil seals replaced. We have a new waterpump and timing belt on Engine #2, which is on the floor next to it.

Stuff we need to reassemble this:
Oil pan gasket
Waterpump gasket
Uh... that's about it. We should have everything else!